... a very unusual problem that I've never heard of before in my ham shack, and I'm not sure I have anything to share. If you've been down the road of troubleshooting intermittent problems you're familiar with the idea that you may spend a lot of time deciding if you've fixed the intermittent problem, or just made it more intermittent.
For one thing, I don't have single picture of the failure when it happens. I've been too distracted by trying to "make it stop!"
Let me start from the beginning. Back in about 2018, I started running the various modes offered by physicist Joe Taylor, the vast majority of the time on what's called FT8. Yes I've used others, mostly FT4 which is like FT8 but less sensitive (less able to copy very weak signals) by using shorter transmit and receive intervals. The trade-off being you give up some sensitivity for shorter contacts - for those days (like today) when maybe you hear another state for a minute. I've used its meteor scatter mode, moonbounce mode, and more.
Over the years, I've worked FT8 on all HF bands and 6m. My station has antennas for 80 to 6m except for 60m, a small chunk at around 5.5 MHz.
A couple of nights ago, with 6 being as dead as it has been, I dropped down to HF, but instead of going to 80/40/30 as I typically go, on a spur of the moment decision, I went to 17m (18.068–18.168 MHz). It's a small band that hams were granted in the '79 World Administrative Radio Conference, or WARC, and the three bands that came out of that are known as the WARC bands. (If you've never heard of 17m, this seems to be a good overview).
One the things I'm used to doing as last check on my station before I start to operate is hit the tune button, which just transmits a carrier at whatever your rig is set to. The (always there inline) power and VSWR meters looked perfectly normal, but nothing else did. Let me show you a screen capture of FT8 software (tuned to 30m - that's the only thing that's different) to make some points.
There are two windows here, the top one is the audio channel from 100 to 3100 Hz, each of the colored areas at the top are individual stations. In general the orange strands that are the most orange (like around 1700 Hz on the top scale) are the strongest, fading down to the more yellow ones (around 2000 Hz and that green rectangle). The spectrum at the bottom is more like a regular spectrum analyzer and is only showing the very topmost thin line of colors. The taller the spectrum the stronger the signal.
When the "bad" happened, that topmost line was replaced by what looked like a continuous spectrum of lots of narrow "spikes," all red. Except spikes tend to have points and bases. This was just alternating big signal and nothing. Maybe like a comb, but all the red "teeth" were the same height and width.
It gets weirder. The needle in the inline power meter that had previously measured the normal roughly 100 W transmit signal was now not showing any power at all. The receiver sounded muted, as it does during transmit. There's a transmit/receive indicator LED on the radio that stayed in transmit (red) instead of receive.
It took a while to get it to stop; I had to reset everything. Turn the radio off and back on, reboot the computer, and several things.
Yesterday, I started looking at it in more detail. I found that it did this on 20m but not higher: 15 to 10. This is helpful because 20 and 17 are on the same antenna, my Tennadyne T6 log periodic (LPDA). The other bands I've been tending to operate, 80, 40, 30 and 6m, haven't shown the issue. Then playing around on 17m, I found I could operate CW or SSB with no problems showing up. The frequency sensitivity made me think something in the LPDA's circuitry might be the problem. Looking up from the ground shows nothing, but it's at 25' above ground, so the view isn't that great. An easy next step seemed to be to check the grounds around the antenna.
So that was today's start. All I could say was that the grounds looked just like the last time I did my routine inspection last spring. Nothing broken, nothing missing, nothing looking like the ground wire was replaced by weeds. They just looked like they've been outdoors and corroded a bit. The next thing to check was connections in the shack and while checking things on 17m again, I noticed the rig control software (Ham Radio Deluxe - HRD) would not always see the radio. So I did the old "unplug it then plug it back in" trick. That's a USB connection from the radio to a little box that sets up the modulation for these WSJT modes. That made a difference. It was easier to recover from the "red comb".
Late in the day (it was nearly 5PM by this time) I decided to retest the setup on 17 and the problem was gone. I tested a couple of times and it worked. I tested 20m - no problems, and worked my way back up to 10 without seeing the problem again. Then I went back to 17 to "soak in the success" of just unplugging and re-plugging one cable. That's when it failed again.
What was that thing about making the intermittent problem more intermittent?
Around the time I sat down to write this I realized, I could use far more pictures than I've got. So I went back to the shack, tuned to 17 and hit the tune button to transmit. No problem. Tried it again - surely it must fail by now? - Nope. I think I transmitted 10 times and it never had the failure. Then I tuned it to a band I've never seen it fail on, 30m, for the picture above.
What's next? Can't say I really know. More experiments and measurements, but I sure don't know what to go after. It looks like it's in the computer control of the rig. I've tried two different versions of the WSJT software, the latest and a somewhat earlier release. I'm on the latest update of HRD.

How long is the USB cable from your computer? Could it be close to a 1/4 wave on those frequencies?
ReplyDeleteAlternatively, could your ground wire be close to 1/4 wave on those frequencies? Sounds like a fun troubleshooting one...
ReplyDeleteThat's along the line I started thinking about. Especially since it seems to be one band. The 17m frequency for FT8 is 18.1 MHz, and 1/4 wave is 12.9 feet long.
DeleteWhich makes me think it's exactly the same length it was when I had no problems last month or last year, or years ago.
I used to misplace USB cables before they went bad, or I had to upgrade to the new version. Now that everything is USB C, that might be more of a problem. But I have had other cables go bad, usually network, but sometimes other stuff as well
ReplyDeleteMore exciting than my shack issues.
ReplyDeleteroject
My rtl-SDR dongle failed, so I had to revert to my Icom PCR1000 software controlled receiver, which is like using a mule after your truck dies.
Looking at new SDR hardware for various projects, but that's a field full of rabbit holes.
"It compiled, so our job is done and we shipped it"
ReplyDeleteIt will be 2030, the astronauts will be on Mars, the COTS will require vendors to supply Windows like on the Zumwalt. It will blue screen, and they will die.
Modern software. Change for the sake of change. Or change for the sake of keeping the software group employed.
DeleteI'm a bit dubious about the 1/4 wave suggestions, but they bring to mind a question. What is the frequency spread, center-center, of the spikes, and is it the same across the band? (Or very close?) Sounds like your "teeth" look like square waves, or very close - that also seems bizarre.
ReplyDeleteYeah, a weird problem. I hate those. I have one where I can bring up a DMR repeater with a Diamond whip on an HT, but not with my Arrow J-pole, same radio. Yeah, coax loss, but I have a hard time believing that ERP using the whip is higher than the J-pole. No problems with other machines at the same site, though I think the DMR repeater is the only 70cm one I've tried. Hmmm, have to look at that piece of it.
- jed
" What is the frequency spread, center-center, of the spikes, and is it the same across the band? (Or very close?) Sounds like your "teeth" look like square waves, or very close - that also seems bizarre."
DeleteYou're going down the road that I've been on. I haven't captured a screen shot of that, but I've left it in the broken mode for several 15 second cycles in a row, and they don't appear to lean higher or lower in frequency, or change at all. Just a comb of vertical lines (which is frequency vs. time). There does seem to possibly be something coming out of the transmitter, even though the power meter reads zero. The video display on the rig (set to show the transmit frequency) will show what looks like broadband noise - the noise floor around where the transmit signal would be.
Do you have another receiver (radio or spectrum analyzer) you can use to validate that hypothesis?
DeleteI wonder if it is some sort of weird resonance / oscillation.
Try changing the length of one of the cables (USB or coax) and see if that changes the frequency ...
Yes, I have both, although I'm not sure what you're thinking. The first thing I examined was the antenna's input impedance (S11) with my mini VNA. It looked very similar to the last scan I saved. Now I looked at that through my antenna switches, and I think the scan I compared it to was the antenna feedline itself.
DeleteThe mini-VNA can act as a spectrum analyzer, but I have an old HP surplus spectrum analyzer, too.
Something that occurred to me this morning is I have a backup transceiver, that worked the last time I tried. It's changing out everything involved at the radio end. Might be worth a look.
Just to followup with the current status (as of about 1900 UTC on Sunday).
ReplyDeleteThe most effective thing I did yesterday was to unplug and the USB cable into the audio input box on top of the rig. It's one of those square plugs, about 1/4 on a side, so I think those USB A family. I tried the station the way it was last night and was doing better. I did about 10 transmit tests before it went into the "audio comb mode". Once I reset everything, I grabbed my can of "Deoxit 5" spray that's always on hand and gave a small spray into the end that plugs into the audio box on top of the rig.
Since then, I worked a couple of stations on 17m, figure about 10 T/R changes (both to and from that box), then and ran around three dozen "tune" button transmissions. No returns of the "comb".
Deoxit seems like a sort of duct tape for electrical connections. I got told about it by my guitar instructor, but have since found a lot of hams using it. I use it all over the place. I hope a wonky USB connect was all it was.
Delete- jed
That's some awful proof reading of myself there.
ReplyDelete"Just to followup with the current status (as of about 1900 UTC on Sunday).
The most effective thing I did yesterday was to unplug and replug the USB cable into the audio input box on top of the rig. It's one of those square plugs, about 1/4 on a side, so I think those are USB A family. Today,I tried the station the way it was last night and it was doing better. I did about 10 transmit tests before it went into the "audio comb mode". Once I reset everything, I grabbed my can of "Deoxit 5" spray that's always on hand and gave a small spray into the end that plugs into the audio box on top of the rig.
Since then, I worked a couple of stations on 17m, figure about 10 T/R changes (both to and from that box), for them and ran around three dozen "tune" button transmissions. No returns of the "comb".
Interesting. Could have been a high impedance ground path.
ReplyDeleteIt may also have been a field-expedient AM receiver (oxide layer functioning as a diode). Interesting that it was so frequency dependent.
I have had this happen to me also. One thing I do is turn on the monitor function in my transceiver when doing digital transmissions. When this happened with wsjt-x there was no audio to the radio. Something similar happened with WinLink. I do not remember the solution off the top of my head as it was a couple of years ago.
ReplyDeleteI use WinLink as I paticipate in our local. ARES (Amateur Radio Emergency Service for those that are not familiar with the acronym) group since it is the closet thing to an amateur club in our small county in Texas.
Thanks for that, Bill. One of the reasons I posted that was hoping someone else had seen the same sort of problem would have some ideas of where to look. Seeing the comb in the audio output as if the rig was locked transmitting when it's powered OFF implies it's in the audio software and not the rig.
Delete